NN3 +Nikon D300+10.5mm = NADIR problem

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  1. NN3 +Nikon D300+10.5mm = NADIR problem

    #1

    Hi folks...i am using for a year NN3 with my Nikon D300 and Tokina 12-24 for shooting panoramas mostly in 360 degree..

    Now I have 10.5mm fish eye and I am trying to shoot 360 x 180 degree panorama but there is a huge problem.

    I do 6 shoots in horizontal, then I tilt the lens up for zenit but for nadir, I remove the Nikon from NN3 and shoot straight down for Nadir...and that is a problem.

    I see my legs...and I can not stiitch panorama? It is Ok if I am on the grass or something like that - I do cloning in photoshop and that is perfectly stitched using the Autopano Giga....but it is mission imposible if I am in a church or anywhere where there are a tiles with texture on the floor...and ad to the problem my legs, besides tiles..and I can not clone that picture for nadir....and I can not stitch

    What to do..how to shoot nadir in flor covered with tiles or textures and to avoid my legs?

    Thanks a lot for help
  2. #2
    Users Country Flag
    Join Date: Aug 2008
    Location: Netherlands
    Posts: 1,740

    Hi,

    Just add a NN Nadir adapter, without removing the camera from your tripod shoot 2x nadir at -90° .

    Just download a trial version of PTGui Pro, mask out your tripod, stitch and set up a template to only add some CP manually in future projects. I prefer my PTGui Pro to my Autopano Giga to solve this problem.

    If you like just download this:

    http://homepage.mac.com/hindenhaag/f...kor10.5_f2.zip

    Workflow: 0°, +5° and +7.5° to check the Zenith Nadir holes with R1/R10, 2x +60° 180° visa versa to test horizontal connection in case of impossible Zenith at +90°, +90°, 2x -90°Nadir with Nadir Adapter.

    Orange dots are laser placed in vertical and horizontal to set up a template in PTGuiPro by spreading CP to the outer circle of the lens in vertical and horizontal direction. You could make a template with this set of pics, adapt it to your project and "fine tune" it with a project shot with your equipment. © 2011 hindenhaag@mac.com

    Feel free to ask. I am working on a video.

    Regards,
    Heinz
    Last edited by hindenhaag; 03-26-2011 at 01:45 PM.
  3. #3

    Hi, thanks for reply..i dont understan why to "shoot 2x nadir at -90° " Why to shoot 2 times nadir at same position?

    any hint for Autopano giga, I am already using it...?

    thanks
  4. #4
    Users Country Flag
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: Los Angeles, CA
    Posts: 348

    Arvinkg,

    What follows applies to PTGui. Not sure if Autopano has the same features.

    After shooting the Zenith (last shot in your series) you rotate the camera so it is pointing straight down at the pano head and take your Nadir shot. Since this view has been taken at the same NPP as the rest of the pano, it will stitch in quite nicely. Now comes the part where you remove the tripod.

    With the Nadir adapter, after you take the 1st Nadir shot, you swing the camera out, slide the tripod over and take your patch shot. This patch shot is actually rotated 180 degrees from the Nadir shot. In Windows Explorer, I rotate this patch shot 180 degrees so it lines up with the Nadir shot.

    After stitching the first 8 pictures together, you bring in the patch shot. You mask out the pano head and tripod in the Nadir shot, mask out the tripod in the patch shot. You can have PTGui auto generate control points between the Nadir shot and the patch shot. If not, you can manually add 4 or 5 control points joining the Nadir and patch shot together. I always turn on viewpoint correction for the patch shot.

    Here is how I do it: http://www.dlsphoto.net/Tutorials/NadirPatch2/index.htm

    In your case where you do not have the Nadir adapter, you still need to take the Nadir shot with the camera on the pano head. After removing the camera and tripod, you hold the camera in the same position it was in and take the patch shot. Be careful to stand in an area where you will be able to mask out your feet and such. Stitching will then follow the same steps as above.

    Hope this clears things up. If not, ask away.

    Dennis
  5. #5
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    Location: Hong Kong
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    Quote Originally Posted by arvinkg View Post
    Hi, thanks for reply..i dont understan why to "shoot 2x nadir at -90° " Why to shoot 2 times nadir at same position?

    any hint for Autopano giga, I am already using it...?

    thanks
    take 2x nadir at -90 deg at 0 and 90 deg horizontal rotation. This patches the the footprints of lower rail and leave the footprint of rotator only.
    alternatively, you can shoot at -15 deg, 6 shots around plus zenith. This reduces the nadir footprint and make nadir patching easier, without using 2x -90 deg shot.

    Nick



    Fanotec
    We listen. We try harder.
  6. a ha

    #6

    denis, thanks a lot..now i undersand..here are my works

    http://www.panoramasrbije.com/index.php
  7. new problem

    #7

    I tryed this way:

    I shoot 6 pics around at 90 degree horizontalu, 1 straight up for zenit and then I turn at -90 degre and shoot for nadir. In that shot I have tripod and head in the view. Then I remove camera from the tripod and my friend remove tripod while I am holding camera in the position like in the previous (7th) shot .

    I import image 7 and 8 (nadir) in photoshop and remove the tripod.

    I import the pictures (8 pics) in Autopano giga2 and stitch the images.

    Everything looks good but I have a one problem, one part of the panorama looks bended..it has no good vertical lines..I tryed PtguiPro and one room (i did those tests in 2 different rooms) and it is better then panorama stiched with Autopano but for another room the Ptgui said "there is not enough control point"

    I uploaded mu stiched photo and original 8 pictures to rapidshare at this link:

    http://rapidshare.com/files/454830962/forum.zip

    can someone try to stitch those photos in order to see if it will be bended at some point so I will know if the problem is software or my NN3 is not in level at all clicks?

    Please,. upload your stiched file so we can discus about.

    Thanks for help people...Arvin
  8. #8

    i have a problem. I made it with your advice...6 horizontal shot and 1 zenit and 2 nadir..one from tripod, and one handheld.

    But I have another problem

    The sticher panorama is a little bend to one side, just a part of panorama. it is always the case with 360 x 180 panorama...

    when I do only 360 degree (horizontal steatchig only) from the same pictures I use for 360 x 180...it is good...perfect verticals...but in 360 x 180, my verticals are bend to the left on part of a panorama,.

    I am using Autopano Giga 2.

    When I try PTGui, it is a little better...but not always.

    In one panorama, PtGui said "there is not enough control points" I tryed to add them but there is no button..render or steach panorama after adding control point....any hint why the part of panorama is bended? I am using NN3

    Thanks
  9. #9
    Users Country Flag
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: Los Angeles, CA
    Posts: 348

    Sounds like you need to add some vertical control points in order to level out your panorama in PTGui. Posting your pictures at this point would help a lot and get you an answer quicker.
  10. #10

    Quote Originally Posted by arvinkg View Post
    In one panorama, PtGui said "there is not enough control points" I tryed to add them but there is no button..render or steach panorama after adding control point....any hint why the part of panorama is bended? I am using NN3
    If you return to the Project Assistant tab and select advanced mode using the button on the right, you will have direct access to all the available tabs. You can then re-optimize the project and generate the output by selecting the appropriate tabs.

    To level the panorama using vertical line control points, see this tutorial. When there are no vertical features, you can level the panorama visually by dragging the image in the Panorama Editor window. See http://www.ptgui.com/man/straighten.html.

    John
  11. #11

    a ha..ok here are the original 8 photos and stitched..please let me know if you stitch images without bendind to one side, and how to add CP for vertical?

    Thanks

    http://rapidshare.com/files/454894559/forum.zip
  12. #12
    Users Country Flag
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    Location: Netherlands
    Posts: 1,740

    Hi,

    Just did a quick check: I started with the 6 around without Z + N to get a better overview.

    I aligned them, then >= got to advanced, >optimizer,>minimize...>heavy + lens shift, >optimize: distance around 18. >ok. then use the top tab list: control point >del worst controlpoint, >optimze: very good: 1,...

    Now go to create pano: and this is what I get without adding any CP.

    http://homepage.mac.com/hindenhaag/f...20Panorama.jpg

    I will add Z + N later on and show you how to add cp manually for vertical.

    I always use heavy and lens shift for fisheye.

    Regards,
    Heinz

    BTW: Don't you loose some pixels with all these stickers on your TV screen? Just a joke....
    Last edited by hindenhaag; 03-29-2011 at 04:32 AM.
  13. #13

    Your nadir will never stitch as it is not taken in the correct NPP and it contains 3D objects.
    If you take panoramas with not flat nadir you have to be able to take the nadir in perfect position.
    It can be done, I now do it almost as standard. It does just need you to use a pointer for the position but using my method for taking the nadir it is done in 2 minutes without any special adapters on the panohead. I even do batch stitching with the nadir included.
    http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/batch-stitching-nadir/

    However your panorama without the nadir stitches perfect if you ad some manual controlpoints at top or bottom of the images.
    I guess also your original will make much more and better auto controlpoints then the small JPG you sent.
    Always use Raw and convert to TIF.

    If you use the vertical controlpoints as John pointed out and optimizes manually with them and with shift included you should have no problems without the nadir.
    Next time you should take the 6 around at -10 degrees. This will make the missing nadir much smaller and you should make sure you only have flat areas missing. Then you can easy stitch the nadir by using the viewpoint option and the mask option in PTGui Pro.
    You have to mask all areas out which are not flat.

    Your current nadir may be possible to ad on a nadir cubeface in photoshop but it will need some special editing

    Oh yes another thing. When your zenith is almost empty of subjects like in this pano take it at +65 instead of +90.
    This will almost always generate enough controlpoints enough for automatic stitching.

    Hans
    Last edited by hansnyberg; 03-29-2011 at 06:01 AM.
  14. #14

    My stitch is at http://www.johnhpanos.com/forum-jh.zip. There are parallax problems at the nadir, which I dealt with by editing the nadir in Photoshop. (I used viewpoint correction on the nadir image to align it correctly with the horizontal shots, but output it in a separate equirectangular image. Rectilinear views were then extracted from the main and nadir equirectangular images for merging manually). It's not quite perfect and needs to be done a little more carefully, but it isn't too bad. You will find blending much easier if you give all the shots exactly the same exposure, aperture and white balance settings.

    John
  15. #15

    ok just 2 questions:

    1. @ hansnyberg: if I shoot zenit at +65, I think I will have missing part from +65 to +90 degree...right? How to stitch zenit with empty part (1 zenit picure)

    2. does anyone know why the panorama is bended to the left? Any chance of corecting it now or will have to take shots again

    thanks

    ps. @john: this is very good.. can you please tell me how you corrected the bending? thanks
    Last edited by arvinkg; 03-29-2011 at 11:09 AM.
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