NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE
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Thread: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

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  1. NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #1



    Greeting forum.

    I have just received my NN3 Rd16 rotator as a package, I have also just purchase an sigma 10-20mm f3.5. The camera I am using is canon 450 or xsi. Could someone help me set this up.. I have search the web and found out that the NNP of the lense is 6 mm behind the gold ring. However I have tried and tried but fail to get a perfect alignment using serveral technique to find the nordal point. I am max out at the top rail of the NN3 and I don't know what I could have gone wrong... Please help .

    thanks in advance.

    Mapkhukho
  2. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #2
    Users Country Flag
    Join Date: Apr 2008
    Location: Hong Kong
    Posts: 2,457

    You may need to get a T-adapter to extend the upper rail.
    Follow this tutorial to find the NPP.
    http://johnhpanos.com/epcalib.htm

    nick



    Fanotec
    We listen. We try harder.
  3. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #3

    According to the settings published on http://www.nodalninja.com/support/camerasettings.html, 94 should be about right for the upper rail using the Sigma lens set at 10mm. Alignment errors in the panorama might be more to do with how you are stitching the images.

    John
  4. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #4

    Hi John

    Thank you very much for your help. I have been using variety of software such as ptgui, pano weawer, and auto pano giga 2. At first I thought it was me that didn't stich correctly and so I have let all 3 software do automatic stitch. and they all give me different incorrect result. I then thought that perhaps i didn't take enough pictures so I have increase pictures from 6 shots +60 0 -60 to 8 shot +60 0 -60. I then experience different result with greater parralax errors. I have also changing rail setting and take different same shots as mention earlier wt 6 and with 8 shot at 3 plane. And yet I have different result both in stitching manually and in automatic in 3 software. I have double check the level bubble and they are level.

    Another question, the sigma lense 10-20mm that i have just purchase is a f3.5 and i have set the lense at manual mode, 10 mm @ infinity. Is what I am doing wrong ? The Attached pictures show error result this was done automatically using auto pano giga 2. Please advise.

    thanks

    mapkhukho
  5. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #5
    Users Country Flag
    Join Date: Apr 2008
    Location: Hong Kong
    Posts: 2,457

    Do you re-level your pano head during the shooting sequence? This should be avoided.
    Can you upload a set of images for others to try the stitching? you can use free uploading service from rapidshare, yousendit, hotfile, mediafire etc.

    nick



    Fanotec
    We listen. We try harder.
  6. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #6
    Users Country Flag
    Join Date: Apr 2008
    Location: Hong Kong
    Posts: 2,457

    Quote Originally Posted by John Houghton View Post
    According to the settings published on http://www.nodalninja.com/support/camerasettings.html, 94 should be about right for the upper rail using the Sigma lens set at 10mm. Alignment errors in the panorama might be more to do with how you are stitching the images.

    John
    I just this is for the old F4 version. F3.5 is 7mm longer. A T-adapter maybe needed.


    nick



    Fanotec
    We listen. We try harder.
  7. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #7

    Hi John:

    I have try your suggested setting, they were with better paralax almost none but gap between pictures after render. Attatched is the 360 pano of the top row and middle row only, bottom row of pictures did not go well with the stitch. all shot done in setting 99.5 top rail and 52.5 bottom rail. please advise.
  8. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #8

    Mapkhukho, To check the setup of your panorama head, do some photographic tests specifically to check for parallax. You cannot judge parallax by simply looking at the output of an automatic stitch. I would hazard a guess that the stitching errors on your panorama are due to poor stitching rather than parallax, but it is impossible to say this with any certainty without having the camera images available for tests. If you can upload half size jpegs somewhere (preferably zipped together), then we could make rapid progress. As Nick suggests, if you don't have your own web space available, there are free services such as:

    http://www.filedropper.com
    http://www.sendspace.com/
    http://sharesend.com/

    John
  9. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #9

    Quote Originally Posted by mapkhukho View Post
    Hi John

    Thank you very much for your help. I have been using variety of software such as ptgui, pano weawer, and auto pano giga 2. At first I thought it was me that didn't stich correctly and so I have let all 3 software do automatic stitch. and they all give me different incorrect result. I then thought that perhaps i didn't take enough pictures so I have increase pictures from 6 shots +60 0 -60 to 8 shot +60 0 -60. I then experience different result with greater parralax errors. I have also changing rail setting and take different same shots as mention earlier wt 6 and with 8 shot at 3 plane. And yet I have different result both in stitching manually and in automatic in 3 software. I have double check the level bubble and they are level.

    Another question, the sigma lense 10-20mm that i have just purchase is a f3.5 and i have set the lense at manual mode, 10 mm @ infinity. Is what I am doing wrong ? The Attached pictures show error result this was done automatically using auto pano giga 2. Please advise.

    thanks

    mapkhukho
    I do not have the newer 3,5 version but I doubt there is much difference, Have not used it much for panos as it is not an ideal lens for it. The settings at 10mm for mine is 98 on the upper rail and for my 20D it is 54mm on lower rail.
    Your 450 may be different on the lower rail.
    You can go up to 107 on the upper rail so you should have enough even if it needs a couple of mm more.

    I suspect from your examples that the problem is that you include the rotator in the images. This is a no-no with a Nodal Ninja as it has to much features to attract the controlpoint generator.
    PLease Nick if you read this. You should move the scale to the back and remove the Logo on the center button. Just put a small centre point.

    The best way to shoot at 10mm is 2 rows with 8 images at -30 and 8 at +45.
    They stitch perfect.
    Avoid also to have any tripod legs in the image if you want to use PTgui viewpoint to stitch nadir.

    And learn to use PTGui to stitch with advanced optimizing.

    Hans
  10. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #10

    Hans

    Thank you very much for the input. I have follow your suggestion and change the setting of rail as well as shooting pictures as 2 rows as you mentioned. The photos indeed look a lot better and much easier to stitch. I am working my way to advance optimizer.

    Nick and John

    Please find the attach location. Sorry for taking so long as I am running in a bit of finding a site to post my pictures. The pictures in the zip file are half of its original size. They are shot in 2 rows of 8 shots at +45 degee and -30 degrees. Rail setting as hans mention at 10 mm f3.5 infinity setting.

    http://www.megaupload.com/?d=7RBXPHO2

    Please advise. Thank you

    mapkhukho
  11. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #11
    Users Country Flag
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: Los Angeles, CA
    Posts: 355

    Your photos stitch just fine with no parallax errors. I rotated then to portrait mode, brought all into PTGui Pro, Auto Align, optimize, auto delete worst control points (there weren't any) and recieved a maximum error of around 2 pixels. It took less than 15 seconds to get a good stitch with no fussing about. You cannot ask for better than that. Your panorama "falls" together quite nicely. I would start examining your stitching software and technique.
  12. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #12

    Quote Originally Posted by mapkhukho View Post
    Hans

    Thank you very much for the input. I have follow your suggestion and change the setting of rail as well as shooting pictures as 2 rows as you mentioned. The photos indeed look a lot better and much easier to stitch. I am working my way to advance optimizer.

    Nick and John

    Please find the attach location. Sorry for taking so long as I am running in a bit of finding a site to post my pictures. The pictures in the zip file are half of its original size. They are shot in 2 rows of 8 shots at +45 degee and -30 degrees. Rail setting as hans mention at 10 mm f3.5 infinity setting.

    http://www.megaupload.com/?d=7RBXPHO2

    Please advise. Thank you

    mapkhukho
    First you should choose another place to take your test panorama. This is actually the worst you can choose with just a lot of grass at the bottom and trees with moving branches above the horizon.
    Ptgui does not generate much controlpoints for this and the branches are unusable for setting controlpoints as they are always moving slightly.

    Either choose a room with lot of good places for controlpoints or an outdoor area with high buildings around you.
    You also did bnot shoot 45 degree but 38 degree for the upper row. With that you do not cover the zenith but you need an extra zenith image.

    There are several ways to shoot with the Sigma 10mm. Another way is 8 around at zero 4 at -30 and 4 at +45.

    As far as I can see you do not have any parallax but the panorama does not have much subjects you can use for checking it.

    Hans
  13. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #13

    Why can you not edit your posts if you have written a something wrong.? I hope the new forum allows that.

    What I wanted to say is that the controlpoints generated in grass may be wrong as PTgui does not like images with same structure in many images.
    In this case PTGui was not able to automatically align the images at my initial trial and I had to manually do it. After that the optimizer worked fine.

    Hans
  14. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #14

    Quote Originally Posted by DennisS View Post
    Your photos stitch just fine with no parallax errors. I rotated then to portrait mode, brought all into PTGui Pro, Auto Align, optimize, auto delete worst control points (there weren't any) and recieved a maximum error of around 2 pixels. It took less than 15 seconds to get a good stitch with no fussing about. You cannot ask for better than that. Your panorama "falls" together quite nicely. I would start examining your stitching software and technique.
    Rotated ?

    These are rotated. The info on them says 90 degree CCW and they are imported in portrait to PTGui.. Are we talking about the same images.

    Hans
  15. Re: NN3+RD16 + CANON 450D (XSI) SIGMA 10-20MM F3.5 HSM NEED HELP SETUP PLEASE

    #15

    When I use my Sigma 10-20mm lens I use a similar arrangement to that suggested by Hans - 8 images horizontally at 45° separation, plus another 8 @ +45° and another 8 @ -45° (although I guess that -30° should also be OK) plus a zenith image just in case and PTGui always returns an Optimisation report of "very good" or "good".

    My attitude is that I have gone to all the trouble of getting to my location and setting up my gear so a couple more images to be sure won't cost me anything.

    Best regards,
    Hugh.

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