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  • Ben Rubinstein
    started a topic Smearing top of 360 pano's.

    Smearing top of 360 pano's.

    Hi,

    Using the NNP points from the website I'm getting a weird smearing at the top of files shot with the Sigma 8mm f3.5 fisheye. This looks like a circle with spikes radiating from it in a virtual tour. I can't seem to get rid of it. I get this with my 16-35L as well though less.

    Any suggestions?

    Many thanks!
    Last edited by Ben Rubinstein; 06-04-2011, 02:28 PM.

  • Ben Rubinstein
    replied
    OK, here is an HDR'd version using the same HDR software but doing the HDR at the single image stage rather than with the stitched file. Hey presto it's fine!

    www.studio-beni.net/New2.html

    Thanks again for all the expertise and most of all for the patience especially as I was barking up the wrong tree for 95% of the time! I really appreciate your help!

    Leave a comment:


  • Ben Rubinstein
    replied
    The HDR program seems to be changing the ratio though only by a pixel or so and that's causing the vortex. I tried filling in the pixel gap with black at the bottom of the frame but it doesn't seem to help though I don't quite understand why.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Houghton
    replied
    Ben, I'm a little surprised to hear that these vortices are being produced with PTGui's blender, though possibly they are somehow due to subsequent processing. If you care to upload a set of camera images that illustrates the problem (one exposure set only, half size jpegs will do), maybe we can get a better idea of what is going on and be in a better position to offer a solution.

    John

    -Edit-
    I gather from the last response of Ben that my guess was right and HDR is the culprit.
    Last edited by John Houghton; 08-22-2011, 04:45 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ben Rubinstein
    replied
    Well! Seems the problem was the HDR program! The weird twisty thing is back again in all its glory! Trying to work out what it's doing that is causing that but it's in line with John's theory that the vortex is software not hardware based. The HDR program is somehow warping the finished stitch. I'm going to try HDR-ing the individual frames pre-stitch to see if that solves the problem.

    Oh and I hadn't forgotten my own thanks for all of you who have been so patient with me! I so wanted to believe in my NN5 and thanks to you I now can!

    Leave a comment:


  • John Houghton
    replied
    Originally posted by Wim.Koornneef View Post
    PS. John, are you sure you see a vortex in Ben's 2 examples, or are you referring to a different pano ?
    Wim, I'm referring to the several panos (except the first) at http://www.studio-beni.net/Bart.html .

    John

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  • hindenhaag
    replied
    BTW: Thx Wim and John for stepping in.

    You got two of the very experts of this forum to get rid of your problem Ben.

    Success,
    Heinz

    Leave a comment:


  • Ben Rubinstein
    replied
    Originally posted by Wim.Koornneef View Post
    Hello Ben,

    The example panos are fine to me, you say there is smearing in it but not visible with regular processing so I think the smearing problem (whatever is was) is tackled.
    I think removing of the dust on lens and/or sensor and removing/reducing the remaining CA is much more important to gain image quality...

    Success,
    Wim
    Thanks Wim, the dust/CA will of course be gone on commercial output, I just didn't bother for this testing.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ben Rubinstein
    replied
    Originally posted by John Houghton View Post
    Ben, The pointy star at the zenith that you are calling "smearing" is often referred to as a vortex and is a blending problem. See my early response dated 06-05-2011 05:34 AM. It has nothing directly to do with the NPP setting. Are you using PTGui and its own blender?

    John

    I was John, only downloaded the other engine for the first time yesterday.

    Leave a comment:


  • Wim.Koornneef
    replied
    Hello Ben,

    The example panos are fine to me, you say there is smearing in it but not visible with regular processing so I think the smearing problem (whatever is was) is tackled.
    I think removing of the dust on lens and/or sensor and removing/reducing the remaining CA is much more important to gain image quality...

    Success,
    Wim

    PS. John, are you sure you see a vortex in Ben's 2 examples, or are you referring to a different pano ?
    http://www.studio-beni.net/New.html
    Last edited by Wim.Koornneef; 08-22-2011, 03:50 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Houghton
    replied
    Ben, The pointy star at the zenith that you are calling "smearing" is often referred to as a vortex and is a blending problem. See my early response dated 06-05-2011 05:34 AM. It has nothing directly to do with the NPP setting. Are you using PTGui and its own blender?

    John

    Leave a comment:


  • Ben Rubinstein
    replied
    Right,

    Here is an example of the problem I was having with the smearing showing up in regular pano's at the zenith (not on first pano but pretty much all the others) http://www.studio-beni.net/Bart.html This was using the NPP values provided by NN.

    Now here is a VT showing two pano's, one shot with zenith and one without, now using the NPP's obtained with the 'smooth' method that Heinz had recommended. The smearing is still there but not showing up with regular processing and the zenith now looks clean: http://www.studio-beni.net/New.html

    I've just gone and shot an HDR of the same scene to see whether the HDR processing is accentuating the smearing. HDR is very important to my shooting as most of the times I get into properties it's the middle of the day and I need to preserve window view details. I'll report back as soon as I've done them!

    Leave a comment:


  • Wim.Koornneef
    replied
    Hello Ben,

    It could be very well that over sharpening in ACR is the reason of the pattern John showed in his screenshot.
    I didn't see this pattern in my output because I processed the RAWs with Canon's DPP software with a moderate sharpening (using a non canon lens with DPP is only possible after modifying the Exif info to fool DPP).
    The pattern itself is normal for many other fisheye lenses when using only roundshots but is not disturbing if the noise is removed and the image is not oversharped.

    The grey spot in the center of John's zenith image is caused by the dark edge of the circular fisheye image, with a smaller crop circle the dark spot is gone but then you have a small hole in zenith, that is the reason why I suggest to use a tilt of +5 degree to get a better coverage of zenith.

    You said that the smearing also occurred in a pano when using rounshots with a downtilt of 15 degree and a zenith shot, the radial pattern John showed is then not possible as there is no overlap of the roundshots in zenith so I am puzzled what the smearing is you are talking about.
    If you show a screenshot, or a crop, of the cubic pano then perhaps that can make clear what the smearing is.

    Wim

    Leave a comment:


  • Ben Rubinstein
    replied
    Originally posted by John Houghton View Post
    Ben, Is this shot of the zenith showing what you call "smearing" : http://tinyurl.com/3otejzz . I think the radial streaking is the stretching of noise due to the image warping at the edge of the image circle. The sharpening you have applied has accentuated the effect. If you apply some noise reduction and don't sharpen in ACR, then the smearing will be considerably reduced. Shooting at a lower ISO setting (with longer exposures) will reduce the noise too.

    John
    I'm getting it even when the zenith shot is the only one used for that part of the zenith, i.e. it's the center of the frame rather than the edge. I'm going to do a test outdoors in a couple of hours (bit tied up now) and post up the results with what should be mm perfect NPP according to the smooth method. Then you guys can tell me what you think.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Houghton
    replied
    Ben, Is this shot of the zenith showing what you call "smearing" : http://tinyurl.com/3otejzz . I think the radial streaking is the stretching of noise due to the image warping at the edge of the image circle. The sharpening you have applied has accentuated the effect. If you apply some noise reduction and don't sharpen in ACR, then the smearing will be considerably reduced. Shooting at a lower ISO setting (with longer exposures) will reduce the noise too.

    John

    Leave a comment:

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