NN5 lower rail setting for Canon 5D Mark II [Archive] - Nodal Ninja Forum

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mikexm
04-18-2009, 06:37 AM
Hello,

When I turn my camera to Nadir and center the camera's central focusing point to the NN5's center bolt, I come up with lower rail setting of 57mm (almost 58mm in fact).

Is that normal? It seems that everybody else is using 53mm. :confused1:

I'm using the standard camera plate (NCP1).

Thanks.

nick fan
04-18-2009, 07:50 AM
Hello,

When I turn my camera to Nadir and center the camera's central focusing point to the NN5's center bolt, I come up with lower rail setting of 57mm (almost 58mm in fact).

Is that normal? It seems that everybody else is using 53mm. :confused1:

I'm using the standard camera plate (NCP1).

Thanks.


confirm your setting with more accurate method
http://www.johnhpanos.com/epcalib.htm


Nick

mikexm
04-18-2009, 08:05 PM
confirm your setting with more accurate method
http://www.johnhpanos.com/epcalib.htm
Nick

Okay, with the method above I was able to confirm that the 5Dm2 is really at 53mm like the 5D.

Using the same method, I was able to fine-tune the "skewed" lens settings. Easy enough to do :biggrin:

Also, if you want to add the Canon 17-40 @ Focal=20mm to the settings page, my result is 110mm.

Thanks!

sebla
05-11-2009, 06:33 AM
Hi Mikexm,

I founfd the same settings than you with the 5DMkII and 17-40. I used the needle technique and found 57 mm. The result using Autopano pro are much better with 57 than with 53.

Seb

raycad
10-05-2009, 10:48 PM
Hi Mikexm,

I founfd the same settings than you with the 5DMkII and 17-40. I used the needle technique and found 57 mm. The result using Autopano pro are much better with 57 than with 53.

Seb


I confirmed the result of 57MM with 5dMK2 is the best setting

Murto-Photo
03-18-2010, 04:08 AM
hi friends


i have the 5d ii with the lens 17-40 L and NN5


i want to ask about the grip for the 5d if i want to add it on the NN5

what is the lower rail setting ?

without grip 57 what about the grip?

thanks :001_smile:

hindenhaag
03-18-2010, 06:02 AM
Hello,

you might use this link to recheck your lower rail setting as well:

http://www.easypano.com/forum/display_topic_threads.asp?ForumID=1&TopicID=4162

In the wiki databse you will find 43,5mm for (H), which means from the bottom of the body to the middle of the lens flange/mount. For the NN5 just add 13mm to get thelower rail postion of the vertical rail.

http://wiki.panotools.org/Entrance_Pupil_Database

Concerning the question of the grip, you have to add this thickness as well. But be careful. The MD200 grip from nikon has an offset in the direction of the camera lens axis of 6mm, which has a consequence for the upper rail setting as well. Besides the point, that you add more weight you get a higher torque on the system with in most cases a little instable battery grips, which are made of plastic.

I do not use a grip any more. I have spare loaded batteries with me, and as the number of shots per second is concerned, which often increases as a battery grip is used, I prefer to use a highspeed CF card as sandisk Pro with 90mb/sec or the normal one with 60mb/sec. This saves time as well during shooting.


Regards

Heinz

jcomfort2
03-18-2010, 08:16 AM
Ok Boys and Girls... :001_smile:
what is it 53 or 57 for the canon 5d mark II? :confused1:
Jac

hindenhaag
03-18-2010, 08:57 AM
Jack, the lower rail setting for this camera is 53...which is wrong, or 57 which is right.

You might have a look to the manuals on this site, there you can learn a bit on how to use the equipment.

Cheers

Heinz

hindenhaag
03-18-2010, 09:16 AM
SIMPLE WAY TO GET THE LOWER RAIL SETTING OF A CAMERA BODY:

Step 1: Place the camera on a table, take a ruler, and measure the distance up to the middle of the lens mount, which in case of Nikon Bodies is the middle of the small silver pin on the right hand side. (H). In this case of the
D90 it measures 42mm when the ruler is attached right to the metal of the lens mount. :wink:

Step 2: Add to (H) the distance between CP/CP-2 to the corner of the vertical rail (see the arrow), is 13mm for the NN5 CP/CP-2: 42mm (H) + 13mm NN5 = lower rails setting of 55.

Hugh, some days ago helped me with the NN3 in a very quick response, the distance for the NN3 CP/CP-2 should be 14mm, but might be 13mm as well. Might be Nick could proof it.

CONCLUSION FOR A SIMPLE WAY TO GET YOUR LOWER RAIL SETTING:

MEASURE (H) , add 13mm for NN5 CP/CP-2
add 14mm for NN3 CP/CP-2


By the way canon guys : (H) in Wiki's database for the 5D MKII is 43,5, and now: plus 13mm for the NN5 is 56,5. I think 57 should be ok.

But test these settings anyway for your own equipment, whatever way you like. I use the hacksaw method mentioned on easypano from Smooth. And yes, as i proofed before with photos, the setting for the D90 is 55.

Cheers

Heinz

hindenhaag
03-18-2010, 09:31 AM
The photos,

Regards

Heinz

hansnyberg
03-21-2010, 08:05 AM
Sorry but your images does not work.
Anyhow they can not be correct unless something has changed radically with the Cameraplate recently.

The CP only ads 10 mm so the 53,5 or 54 mm is correct.

However you can easy get an error because of a different issue,
Your bottom plate on the Camera may not at all be in angle with the lens flange.

I discovered this when I got my 5D Mark II which suddenly needed 2mm more on the bottom plate.
I have always used 52mm with my old 5D with perfect results.

After checking all my Canons I discovered that only the new Mark II was plain.
My old 10D , 20D and 5D all had a bottomplate that needed correction with a ducktape like this.
http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/NPP/5D/taped-bottomplate.jpg

The longer lens you use the larger error you get.
Easiest way to check this is to do this.
http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/NPP/5D/level-camera.jpg

Hans

hansnyberg
03-21-2010, 08:20 AM
Ok after doing some searches I can see there is a new Camera-plate which I can see ads 13 mm.

So this will give you 57 instead of 54 with the old plate.

However it still does not change that you should check your bottomplate on the camera.

Hans

hindenhaag
03-21-2010, 11:29 AM
Hello Hans,

Thx for your comments. I appreciate them cause I was reading a lot of you, I had to learn, that you are one of the people to be engaged in panorama photography since a long time. I have read your comments in several forums. About Npp, Nadir, your tutorials, etc. Your work on the panorama website. http://www.panoramas.dk http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=Hans+nyberg&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8.

So everybody should know whom we are talking with. I know you are a canonian. :wink:

I personally know, I am not perfect too. If we are not working there will be no mistakes. But because I know that very experienced people are "watching", I try to proof before posting.

I think you understood my thoughts Hans: When we know (H) from the camera body, and we know the "offset" of the vertical rail, no matter what body we use, we should get the lower rail setting.

I always tell people, they have to check it with their own combination. But I feel people might be "quicker on the road to panorama" with hints like this.

And, because I know "Big Brothers are watching Me"...I try to avoid mistakes. But sometimes I do some of them. So before I placed this comments, I had already checked the lower rail setting of different nikon bodies: D3, D200, D90, D5000, D3000.

For example, and I placed my settings with photos of the D90 on this forum before: it is 55mm. So I just measured (H) from D90 42, plus offset 13mm, gives 55mm.

Let us ask Nick about the offset: NN5 and NN3....

Anyway, I felt scarred that some of my NPP measurements changed with CP-2 CP and "Hacksaw" lower rail setting test and upper rail settings in a few point for nikkor lenses. I will send these soon,but I like them being proofed by Bill and Nick before, though I know what I did. I know you have to test it with the camera on the plate, the photo was just taken to explain the offset of the vertical rail measurements to get the lower rail setting

But I think I may feel free to ask you for Canon questions, cause I think both of us follow the same goal. I do not like discussion like comments of Matt Rodgers /answers of Smooth and the rest going on on Panoguide. I think you know what I am talking about.

Once again,

Thanks a lot for our comment, this proofs being right or wrong to give the best information to the "guys", ups, and "the ladies"

With best regards,

Heinz

hindenhaag
03-21-2010, 01:02 PM
Hans,

I think this is our lifetime and it is amazing "that people long ago knew what we are talking about". :wink:

http://www.lastfm.de/music/The+Beatles/_/We+Can+Work+It+Out

Regards, and i love this forum,

Heinz

hindenhaag
03-25-2010, 11:44 AM
Sorry guys,

got an IM question and tried to answer, but i am not sure that it worked. I could not see that it was send. So try to do it this way: I just used Google translator to translate english to arabic. I hope it is nothing in there like "put the camera on the grill before you start shooting. The mail looks funny, but I hope for somebody who does not speak so much english it might help even with " the camera on the grill" . Thanks a lot for your understanding guys.

:confused1:?? ?

?? :confused1:? ?? 57 ?? :confused1: :confused1:? ?? :confused1::confused1:. :confused1: :confused1:?? :confused1:? batterygrip :confused1::confused1: :confused1: :confused1: :confused1:?.

:confused1:? :confused1:?? 57 :confused1: :confused1: :confused1:? :confused1: :confused1::confused1: :confused1: :confused1:?? :confused1:?? :confused1:??. ?? :confused1: :confused1:? :confused1: :confused1: 57 ?? :confused1:?. :confused1: ?? :confused1:? ?? :confused1:.

:confused1::confused1:? ?? :confused1:? :confused1:?? :confused1:? :confused1:?? :confused1:?. 13 :confused1: :confused1: :confused1:?? ?NN5/Cp-2 :confused1:? :confused1::confused1:? :confused1: :confused1::confused1:?? ?? batterygrip.

:confused1::confused1: :confused1::confused1:? :confused1:?? :confused1::confused1:?? ?17 - 40mm : ?? ?? ?? :confused1:?? ?? :confused1: :confused1: :confused1:? :confused1::confused1:? ? :confused1:? :confused1:? :confused1: ?? :confused1: :confused1:?.

:confused1: ?? :confused1:? :confused1:? :confused1:? ?? :confused1:? ? :confused1: :confused1: :confused1::confused1:? :confused1:?? :confused1:?.

:confused1:? ?? :confused1:??.

:confused1:??

Bill Bailey
03-25-2010, 12:19 PM
Please IM me the user name. We get hit many times a week with spammers and best I run his IP.

Bill Bailey
03-25-2010, 05:25 PM
clean - thx

hindenhaag
03-25-2010, 11:26 PM
Hello again,

to get the lower rail setting with and without battery grip, you can just measure the height from the table to the small silver pin on the right hand site of the Nikon and Canon bodies. The rest might have something like this as well.

Mount the grip and measure this distance. Then add 13mm for NN5, 14mm for NN3 ( I will set the 14mm sharp this weekend). This is your lower rail setting.

Then TEST YOUR OWN SETTING TO PROOF IT !!

Cheers,

Heinz

hindenhaag
03-25-2010, 11:34 PM
Question NPP for Canon 17-40mm Canon 5D I


17 NPP 109.5

28 NPP 108.5

40 NPP 110.5

These measurements come from Wiki database http://wiki.panotools.org/Entrance_Pupil_Database , added L1 + L2

Reading reviews about this lens, it is said that the NPP's sit close together and do not change much. So be aware when testing all the zoom settings.

And please report your own measurements to us.

Thx
Heinz

hindenhaag
03-26-2010, 05:19 AM
Canon 5D II, 17-40mm

17 8 45 +30
+/- 90
8 45 -30




This is what I found for spherical panorama and this camera lens combination.

Heinz

hansnyberg
03-30-2010, 09:58 AM
Mount the grip and measure this distance. Then add 13mm for NN5, 14mm for NN3 ( I will set the 14mm sharp this weekend). This is your lower rail setting.

Then TEST YOUR OWN SETTING TO PROOF IT !!

Cheers,

Heinz


Apparently this is not correct. I just got a brand new NN5 with the new CP2 type and it is still 10mm.
Unless Nick is skipping several versions ther is no difference from the old CP.

Hans

hindenhaag
03-30-2010, 12:35 PM
Hans,

this is your second comment about "this is not correct".

Reading another comment about this thread from you I think till now you did not understand of what I was talking about. I am not talking about thickness of camera plates. Cp - CP2. Nick is an experienced designer, knowing that if he would change the size of CP to CP-2, this would have changed the lower rail settings. So, this is still the same measurement. Thx Nick.

I try to explane my thoughts for you Hans.

I try to find out principles for lower rail settings to help newbies as well as experienced users: what about a new lens or camera body? What is changing? Nodal Ninja products from camera to camera? Not at all.

To find the lower rail setting you need (H) , you know the database, http://wiki.panotools.org/Entrance_Pupil_Database, plus the "Offset" of the NN product from the (H) to the corner of the vertical rail which gives you the lower rail setting. When you have a look to your brand new product, you might realize setting upper and vertical rail on the same niveau, that there is an offset to the corner of the vertical rail to the touch point of the camera mounting plate >10mm+"measurement of the whaterver plate".

This is what I am talking about. I try to make things simple for newbies by looking for principal of the whole system. Set this in a database "how to find". Not talking about thickness of CP's. Be sure I tested this before writing a comment.

My personal conclusion, to find lower rail settings easily and test them with your own equipment, measure (H) of your camera and add the offset 13mm for NN5 and 14mm for NN3. I tested this with my brand new equipment NN3 and
my "old NN5". I like it. :001_smile:

I will add a photo, I think everybody can read this.

Anybody who tries to tell me I am wrong, I feel free to accept a proof!

Hans, and all the rest of experienced followers on panophotographie, let us try not to get newbies weared with our comments.

Whenever we'll meet, a accept a champagne from you for excuse. I like your knowledge and comments on several forums. But I set a stop when I feel there is something wrong.

Cheers,

Heinz

hindenhaag
03-30-2010, 12:51 PM
Btw, a quick shot in my kitchen at home.

So now comments about the quality. :wink:

Nothing to do with the very well designed products of Fanotec and Nodal Ninja.

"Turning us around", "We listen", "Beyond Horizons", "We try harder", the next comment we should see: Fanotec!, Nodal Ninja!.

This will proof they feel to do their best, Nick, and Bill, and all the other employes. I hope they will place something like : "Cause we do more!" This is reality!

Regards Heinz

hindenhaag
03-30-2010, 01:11 PM
BTW,

though I am a Nikonian, though I hate battery grips cause of offset in vertical horizontal cause of "plastic equipment" making the camera to move off of the vertical etc, offset in upper rail settings related to offset of the tripod mount Camera Battery Grip:

I asked canon support about the (H) of battery grips which have to be adde to the (H) of the body to find the lower rails setting, an incomplete answer but they answered!

Canon 450D, 1000D, EOS XSi, T1i the height of the additional (H) of the Body is 114,3mm, so 115mm,

Canon 5D MK II add 103,1, so try H 103.

This is my way to "try to keep it simple" . Because the main point is to go out to shoots on it's best.

Regards

Heinz

hansnyberg
03-31-2010, 02:48 AM
Sorry Heinz but something is very wrong with your measurements for the NN5.
In your first post you claim.

"In the wiki databse you will find 43,5mm for (H), which means from the bottom of the body to the middle of the lens flange/mount. For the NN5 just add 13mm to get thelower rail postion of the vertical rail."

This was before I got the new NN5 with the CP2 and it lead me to the incorrect conclussion that the CP2 was adding 13mm instead of 10mm as the old CP1.

So thats why I corrected it. Your images on the first post does not work and I had no idea what your measurements was on it.
Do you really have a NN5.
If so it must be a different version than the 2 I have.

This is how mine look.
http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/nodalninja/NN5-A-scale.jpg
As you can see the correct measurement for the 5D is 43,5mm + 10mm on my first version but the current production ads 1mm more so it is 43,5+11mm = 54,5mm

The NN3 has 5mm to ad so it will be 43,5+10+5 = 58,5mm if you use the Camera plate and 48,5mm without it.

If someone has a NN5 with different measurements please tell me.

Hans

hindenhaag
03-31-2010, 05:29 AM
Hans,

the photo from yesterday is one of my new NN3 Mk II, which I baught to check meassurements. Just to demonstrate what I was talking about.

Now I send the picture of my NN5 w, which I baught in 12/2008 mounted with a new CP-2 and all I can read is 13mm. I checked all my lower rail settings and I end up for 13mm with my NN5.

So what we can say is, that everyone has to check his equipment concerning the offset, in our cases between 11 and 13mm, and may add this to ( H ) to get the lower rails setting.

Heinz

hindenhaag
03-31-2010, 05:33 AM
ups, small...

hansnyberg
03-31-2010, 06:36 AM
Check your mounting Knob. The first delivered was to thick. If that is the one you use on that picture you will ad 2mm to the measure.

Hans

Bill Bailey
04-21-2010, 06:29 AM
Unless Nick is skipping several versions ther is no difference from the old CP.
Hans

This is correct - no difference in settings between CP-1 and CP-2 - both camera plates are the same thickness.
Bill

Croce
10-25-2011, 03:58 PM
This bottom rail controversy is all dependent on what mounting hardware is used for the camera on the upper rail.
53-57mm us fine if you are using CP1 or CP2 however if you are using quick mounts the situation changes dramatically because those types of mounts are much thicker.
I am using a RRS L bracket on my 5D MKII and mounting that to the NN (ASQRS2) arca style quick release which is substantially thicker when put together.
The end result is that 67mm is the correct setting for the lower rail on my NN5L with my mounting system.
Hope this helps some solve the lower rail setting problem
Croce

hindenhaag
10-25-2011, 10:10 PM
Thx for sharing Croce,

actually one always has to add the thickness of the new equipment to "old LRS -10mm for CP-1/CP-2".

Enjoy your equipment,
Cheers,
Heinz